SAGE vs. LOOMIS

[fish james]

So santa bought me a new Loomis GL2 9' 5w for christmas this year, and so far, it'sfar better in every way than my lower end Temple Fork rods. Anyway, I've noticed a lot if interest on this site about Sage rods and i was wondering how they compare to a Loomis.

[TS30]

I have a 7.5 foot 3 wt Temple Fork that I love for the small streams and dry flies. It is a fun little rod.

I have a 9ft 5wt GL3 that in my limited opinion is one of the best all-around rods on the market. Again, that is my opinion. If I could change anything, I would make it a 6wt for a little more get up and get out on the stillwaters.

Having only casted a Sage (I don't even know the model) a couple times when with my friend on the river, I definitely prefer my loomis. But I acknowlege that to each his own will apply on this thread. So, as I have been probably no help, I'm going to stop typing and slowly step away from the keyboard!!!!!

[Scudslug]

I prefer the Sage, mostly because the "Fear no Fish" slogan is pretty lame.

[Danny]

My bread and butter rod is a Loomis GL3 9' 5wt. I absolutely love that rod. I have a friend with a Gl2 and a Sage (middle quality Sage, can't remember the model) I really hate the GL2, and love the feel of his Sage. To each his own. Just my opiniopn that really means nothing in the grand scheme of things. When I stated at 12 years old I fished with a Fenwick Glass pole (note I did not refer to it as a rod) and caught a ton of fish on that p.o.s. Do whatever works for you!

[Endgin]

Any comparison of the two has more to do with what feels right to you than a straight forward "better or worse". In the low end, their is huge difference between good sticks and long spinning rods. You can tell in two casts. Find one that feels right in relation to your casting stroke. I tell everyone who steps in the shop to CAST the rod they have planned on buying, along a few others of similiar weights and lengths. One of the rods will "tell you" which is the right one. You will know which one fits you just by stringing one up- sales pitches, catalog talk, advertising hype, etc,. mean nothing when choosing a good rod. Casting is the only way to truly find a match. I have bought both great and terrible rods in relation to my stroke, by accident (i.e. not trying them out before I cut a check), I have yet to buy a rod that I haven't loved after casting it AND some of the alternatives and finding the best fit for me. If you are curious about a Sage, bring your GL2 to WRF, and cast it in comparsion to a Sage Launch or a Scott V2 (we'll set it up and let you play). This isn't a sales pitch- trying things out will let YOU decide which is the best rod for you.

[Scudslug]

I'm suprised that there haven't been any comment related to the "Fear no Fish" slogan. Nothing says white trash more than a "Big Johnson", "No Fear", or "Fear No Fish" sticker on the back of your F150 4" lift truck. I would have thought that there would be a revolt by the mullet wearing crowd, but I guess that the Sportsman Wearehouse crowd is staying quiet rather than sticking up for their G-loomis rod.

[S&P]

I agree that it is a pretty lame slogan. I don't care much for the look of the rods either-- especially the reel seats. I've casted just one loomis-- can't remember what model but it was one that LuckyB built and fished. I like my XP much more. Suits my cast like a glove.

[Marty]

Both are production rods made to sell. Never cared much for either but own both. G. Loomis has been building rods far longer than Sage, Sage just has had better marketing. My brother-in-law has been asked to test and then write and article on the top 30 5 weights. He should have the rods in the next week or so. If anyone is interested in see how the rods match up we will be conducting the test at Sugar House Park and on the MP.

[nativecutt]

I would be interested. Is that Dec doing the round up?

[coreyk]

i have a 3wt xp and a 4wt glx .. both are fast rods, but i like the way the glx loads much better. Again .. its just what 'fits' you best.

[Marty]

nativecutt yes-I will keep you posted

[nightfish]

Hey Marty,

What kind of parameters are there for the review? Are 30 mfg's submitting what they think is their best 5wt, or are a small handful of mfg's submitting every 5wt they make to fill the 30 spots? Are the labels absent, or at least covered? Are they all strung with the same line? Single blind testing? Double blind testing?

[skighhigh]

A friend was telling me about something he read on 5wt rods, and I think the consensus came down to the 8 1/2 ft 2-piece 5wt from Tom Morgan Rodsmiths.
From what I learned the Winston 8 1/2 5wt 2-piece WT is the rod by which all rods are compared, according to whom said this I don't recall. Have to do some research.

Marty you ever read or heard that?

[cheech]

A friend was telling me about something he read on 5wt rods, and I think the consensus came down to the 8 1/2 ft 2-piece 5wt from Tom Morgan Rodsmiths.
From what I learned the Winston 8 1/2 5wt 2-piece WT is the rod by which all rods are compared, according to whom said this I don't recall. Have to do some research.

Marty you ever read or heard that?

What is the rod you just bought?? Just curious;)

[skighhigh]

What is the rod you just bought?? Just curious;)

The above said rod. Why does my opinion sound bias?


cheech,

The wife just landed a new job. Maybe I can afford that Steffen Brothers blank now.

[Marty]

I am not sure on how the testing is going to be done. Dec did say it will be done with the same line. I am sure we will see more than one five weight from the bigger companies. But all the manufactures should be represented.

I have heard that the Winston was the #1 rod at one time. But as with all the rod company’s rods have changed as new materials come out. Scott tried to keep the Gs the same but the market has force even them to change.

I have a 9’ 6 Steffen that I have had for almost 20 years, I went to there shop when they were wrapping rods using a 2X4 as a press, a drill to turn the shrink wrap and a sewer pipe as an oven. Its rod makers like them that bring class into the industry.

With the progression of rod building the number one 5 weight today more than likely will be surpassed next year by another. Its just like buying a computer.

[skighhigh]

Do you think the Tom Morgan Rodsmiths are much further set apart from the Winston WT, that was his idea in the beginning I think. Will you guys get one of TMR's new rods to see if it still holds true?

[Marty]

You have got me on that one, I did not know Tom Morgan was building composite rods. I thought he had teamed up with Bill Blackburn to build cane. I am positive we will not see any cane rods for the testing. I have never been much of a Winston fan, not because of the rod. I have a two hander now and love it.

[skighhigh]

Yellowstone Angler George Anderson 5 wt shootout, I am in the process of reading it


http://www.yellowstoneangler.com/FlyRodComparisonAlbrightG.LoomisOrvisSageScottTemp leForkThomasThomasTomMorganRodsmithsR.L.Winstonrod testing.asp


Tom Morgans website

http://www.troutrods.com/

[robinsoj]

I have had the GLX Stream Dance for years. It's a sweet rod. If I had a comparable Sage instead, I would probably say the same thing.

I had a GL3 before the GLX, so I am happy with Loomis.

The GLX is spensive. Personally, I don't think any rod is worth that much money, but we all just need to make a lot more money, right. ;) James at Hooked took $100 or more off the retail price which helped, though.

The decorative California Buckeye Burl has cracked in several places with my rod. Salt Lake is probably not the best area for it hehe. I could probably get the entire rod replaced for $50, though. Loomis takes care of their customers pretty well. I actually broke two GL3's and it just cost me $50 total to get replacements. One GL3 went down before I got to cast it hehe.

[Marty]

skighhigh thanks now I am hoping they have sent one. I have not been following the Winston saga that close. I know part of the company took of and start a grassroots movement. It sounds like Winston has turned into a Sage, just another production rod.

[ute]

when were you and Dec going to tell me about all this. If there is anyone in this world that doesn't have any bias towards one rod company or another it's me. I could give a shit about any of them, a rods a rod you both know that. It will be fun for me to see if I can still cast a single handed rod. Talk to you soon, DEC too.

Fish hard
Be safe

Your big brother

[Endgin]

Skyhigh dreams of being a kept fishing slave. Tell Brit congrats- was it job No. 1 or did she end up getting No. 2 (the big one)?

As for rod testing- How are you going to classify them? Points for each characteristic? Fit and finish? Personal opinions? Kinetic energy to parabolic deflection rates? (Yeah I made that one up, but the point stands) I know that if I cast 5 rods by different manufacturers, I will find one that I like better than the others. If you ask Skyhigh he is probably going like a different one, just on principle. (Difficult dude, that Skyhigh.) Is the tester(s) affiliated with any of the rod manufacturers? Do you nymph fish all the time, huck streamers on sinking lines, exclusively fish the Henry's Fork with dries, fish tiny Creeks in the Uintas, or do all of those at any given time? Does he or she have excellent castings skills and throw effortless loops, or he or she a rough hack working at perfecting loading the rod- these things matter in "what" makes a person like a certain style of rod.

I am not suggesting that testing is a bad thing- I am simply saying casting them and rating them is not a simple process. I have casted rods from TFO, Sage, Loomis, Cabela's, Winston, Scott, Orvis, St. Croix, Fenwick, Thomas and Thomas, Echo, Hardy, and probably more brands that I can't remember, and I still can't say one brand is strictly superior compared to others. Certain rods fit my style and I do have brands I definitely lean towards (Winston's are my current favorite trout rods), but I am not you. You might pick up my 8 1/2 BII-x 5wt and think it too noodly, too fast, too expensive, or whatever. Try lots of rods. Pick the one that feels right. (Vague answers are the best ones, grasshopper) Learn to cast it to the best of your abilities. Understand what ratings mean. Generally ratings are opinions, not really provable facts. Be sceptical of ratings in advertising driven magazines- you can often find a direct correlation between pages of glossy and how highly rated or how many kudos awarded. I am not saying that these rags are lying- some well advertised rods are the reel deal. For the right owner. Just cast them and decide from there.

[skighhigh]

If there is anyone in this world that doesn't have any bias towards one rod company or another it's me. I could give a shit about any of them, a rods a rod you both know that.

Do I sound Bias? (Just quoting ute, I didn't think this had any direction)

I'm not bias, all though them green sticks are mighty perty, the 5wt I liked was the g2885, sweet stick. But I will confess I went for the green stick on principle alone, (Dang Endgin knows me to well).........LOL

Not to sure on the which job of the two, wife will know more on monday. They are the same company, a little travel, and a good amount of extra money, so the '08 bonefish trip is on the horizon.

[skighhigh]

Skyhigh dreams of being a kept fishing slave. Tell Brit congrats- was it job No. 1 or did she end up getting No. 2 (the big one)?


Not a kept fishing slave, but she did say ther would be another rod in my future!

[ute]

I was talking to Marty (my little brother) and Dec (my brother in law) both of them could snap a branch off a tree and throw a 5 wt 80 ft. That's why it will be fun to see what 5 wt they both will lean towards. This test has been done in the past a number of times it's just being done now by somebody we all know.

fish hard
Be safe
Ute

[ute]

I think Endgin is right on with what he is saying. It's all personal, use the 5 sences (even the taste of the cork) that's how we all choose our rods. Decs going to be casting these rods not fishing them, I have always thought that it isn't the same. I will tell you right now Burkhiemer makes the best of both worlds. It's one thing throwing a 5 wt some 100 + ft which is way cool for some (never got into that) and another thing to be able to make a pinpoint cast under an overhang and then turn around on the next run and have to put on a couple of split shot. That to me is the rod I want, a fishin rod, not a casting rod I allready know I can throw it far enough to fish.

AGAIN

Fish hard
be safe

Ute

Marty call me

[cheech]

As I found myself licking and smelling the cork on the G2 904, I found that the little burled piece at the top of the grip came to my liking. That, and I could feel everything about the cast... Sweet stick. I'm not an expensive rod guy. IM6 is IM6 right? Well, that rod will soon be mine. It'll be hard to replace my $15 4 wt, but I think I'll do.


Skighhigh is just a Winston snob. His opinion doesn't count. BTW, have Brit get you the TM rod. THAT is true love.

[Endgin]

At least brit is talking about a new rod in your future, not her future...
LOL

[Marty]

The rods are here and we are starting the testing on Thursday at Sugar House Park. Dec is not the first to receive the rods, they have been traveling the country. From the sound of things it is going to be quite the testing process. Distance is not part of the criteria. I would have to say the stiffer rods that you have to double haul to load 30 feet will rank low. This will be a casting test for all around performance. Unlike golf they have not developed a machine that can cast a rod for testing. So we have to depend on the human factor. One thing that I really like about this type of testing is neither Dec or I are going into this with any preconceived notions on which is the top rod. It’s going to be a lot of fun and I can’t wait to get my hands on them rods. The best part is we are not trying to sell rods and there will be no pressure to like something I don’t. Ute, I would have to say you casting stroke would be perfect for this type of a test. Can’t wait to see if we pick the same rod.

I will post an update after the first round of testing.

Ute, I make the front page of Desnews and you don’t say anything?