Wicked Awesome flies for sale!

[cheech]

In order to pay for future fishing trips, debt, and girls nights out, I’m going to start selling flies. I will tie just about anything for a reasonable price. It it’s a moderate fly that takes some time (EHC, PT, etc.), I’ll sell them for $18 per dozen. If they are easy ties (zebra midge, yong special etc.) I’ll sell them for $12 per dozen. Bass flies are $2.50 each. I will also tie a variety of flies if you don’t want a full dozen of any one fly. If you want pics of my flies, I can send them if you email me. cheechfisher@gmail.com

[UtahFlyGuy]

Cheech what about building rods?

[icthys]

Deliver pizza's man, you get free dinner too.

[Dean Wareham]

I tied "professionally" in the past. I wouldn't recommend it. There is a reason flies are tied in Sri Lanka in sweat shops. At $18 a dozen you will be working for about $5 an hour. I would recommend a side job. Think about your profit margin, the time you will put in to it and how much realistically you think you can make. A part time job especially one that will pay you under the table or one in which you will get tips is a much better way to go. Of course that doesn't sound as impressive as telling your friends that you are a professional fly tyer.

[Doug S.]

I tied "professionally" in the past. I wouldn't recommend it. There is a reason flies are tied in Sri Lanka in sweat shops. At $18 a dozen you will be working for about $5 an hour. I would recommend a side job. Think about your profit margin, the time you will put in to it and how much realistically you think you can make. A part time job especially one that will pay you under the table or one in which you will get tips is a much better way to go. Of course that doesn't sound as impressive as telling your friends that you are a professional fly tyer.

Just taking a guess but I'm pretty sure he knows what he's in for...:) Not his first rodeo

[Curtis Fry]

Yep, Cheech is not a newbie to the arena.

If you like some really good flies, he's your guy. $18 a dozen is a steal for the quality (and these are flies you won't find being tied in Thailand, China or anywhere else).

[cheech]

I tied "professionally" in the past. I wouldn't recommend it. There is a reason flies are tied in Sri Lanka in sweat shops. At $18 a dozen you will be working for about $5 an hour. I would recommend a side job. Think about your profit margin, the time you will put in to it and how much realistically you think you can make. A part time job especially one that will pay you under the table or one in which you will get tips is a much better way to go. Of course that doesn't sound as impressive as telling your friends that you are a professional fly tyer.


Thanks for the warning, but I'm pretty consistent at 2.5 dozen per hour. If it's more complicated stuff, it's 2 dozen per hour. That's a bit more than $5/hour.

As far as rods, I guess I could do that too. Just shoot me an email with what you want and I could give you some quotes.

[jccollier]

Dude, shoot me an e-mail....I need you to quote me on building a 20' 16wt Sturgeon rod :)

[cheech]

Dude, shoot me an e-mail....I need you to quote me on building a 20' 16wt Sturgeon rod :)

I knew I might hook a sucker with this post.

Oh, and BTW, 14wt is as high as I go. DOOPA GUY!

[jccollier]

I'll call you later......

[Red.Fly]

That's a fly every 2 minutes!!!! I'd only have to tie one day a year at that rate! I'm not calling BS, I'm just in awe.

Sounds too much like work instead of pleasure for my liking. Then again, the only reason I have to tie fast is when I don't have a fly I want in my box and I'm in a hurry to hit the river.

[Rod Hog]

I will tie just about anything for a reasonable price.



Careful Cheech, the competition is mighty stiff. Fly Smyth is liable to bury you!

[Dean Wareham]

That is a fly every 2 minutes hour after hour after hour. I am not calling BS but unless your name is AK Best I think you will be looking for another way to fund your cupid bill. Have you thought about advertising costs, shipping, how much profit you will actually make per fly. Have you considered how turning a pleasant hobby and past-time into a business usually sours a person on that hobby? Have you considered that you will be required to pay various excise taxes on flies sold? Justifying how much profit can be made selling hand tied flies is like a hunter that has a new rifle, new truck, new ATV, new scope, new rangefinder, new GPS unit, new Gore-tex boots, etc, justifying that it is much cheaper to shoot an elk rather than just going to the store and buying sirloin on sale.

[cheech]

Dean,

Maybe you are right. Maybe I should disregard my last experiences with fly tying, and trust that you know better than I do.

I thoroughly enjoy the whole tying experience. Even if it means production tying. If it ever gets to the point that I'm tying too much, I'll hire Curtis and some of the guys that are putting in his carpet to help.


2 minutes per fly = BS??? Here's how I time myself. I crank up the music, and I tie two flies per song. Each song is approximately 4 minutes long. I'm not saying that I keep us that pace the whole time, but I can if I need to. I usually tie with my kids for a few hours a night anyway. With them wanting to do their own buggies, and my daughter wanting to give each one of them kisses, I guess it slows me down a bit, but I can cope.

If you still want to argue your point, do a search for Pavlik, and shoot him off an email.

[fulano]

I thoroughly enjoy the whole tying experience.

Dude, you're sick.

I wish I liked to tie more than I do, but I can't even keep up with my own fishing needs.

[«°Ñøvã°»]

Dean,

Maybe you are right. Maybe I should disregard my last experiences with fly tying, and trust that you know better than I do.

I thoroughly enjoy the whole tying experience. Even if it means production tying. If it ever gets to the point that I'm tying too much, I'll hire Curtis and some of the guys that are putting in his carpet to help.


2 minutes per fly = BS??? Here's how I time myself. I crank up the music, and I tie two flies per song. Each song is approximately 4 minutes long. I'm not saying that I keep us that pace the whole time, but I can if I need to. I usually tie with my kids for a few hours a night anyway. With them wanting to do their own buggies, and my daughter wanting to give each one of them kisses, I guess it slows me down a bit, but I can cope.

If you still want to argue your point, do a search for Pavlik, and shoot him off an email.

Makin an extra buck and spending time with the kids=priceless...i want the kissy flies send me a DZ

[cheech]

Makin an extra buck and spending time with the kids=priceless...i want the kissy flies send me a DZ


She's a redhead to boot. They are fish catchin' suckers.

[Dean Wareham]

Cheek
I have no doubts that you are a quality fly tyer. I started tying in 1976. In the mid 1980's and again in the 1990's I tried to make a buck or two at it. The rationale you have presented is no different than hundreds of other quality fly tyers out there. I am just saying it is a very hard way to make a consistent buck. It isn't how good you are, it is how you manage your costs and how much profit you actually turn. Remember you are only selling these for around $1.50 to $2.00 a pop, you have to generate a large volume to make any kind of money at all. Have you actually sat down and tried to figure out how much profit you will actually make per fly? Why don't we use a parachute adams or royal wulff as an example how much pure profit will you make selling one dozen of either of those flies? Again I do not question your abilities as a fly tyer. I question your cost accounting skills.
If you want to get into something where you can make money why don't you start building a few bamboo rods? I just paid $1,100 for one yesterday.

[Foamy8]

Now Dean, don't rain on his parade. If you want to give him money so he doesn't have to tie, go ahead. It takes all kinds and if he's willing to do it, let him. Make a niche, find it, and stay there. I'm sure he's not going to quit his day job to tie flies, but a couple extra bucks doing something he likes isn't a bad idea to me.

[kingsonthefly]

Email sent

[Red.Fly]

Well cheech, I guess Dean just can't help himself. He's clearly superior to any of us in his accounting skills. Then again, he just spent $1100 on a bamboo rod that's heavy, slow and prone to rod set so his decision making skills might be lacking (nothing against bamboo, but there's a reason graphite rods were invented). It seams pretty clear to me that tying flies to make a couple hundred green backs isn't the type of money he's accustomed to.

I guess I figure that if you're going to be tying anyway, you might as well sell a few dozen dozen and get some extra coin in your pocket. I tie all my own so I won't be buying any, but who am I to rain on your parade.

[Tyson]

Thanks for the warning, but I'm pretty consistent at 2.5 dozen per hour. If it's more complicated stuff, it's 2 dozen per hour. That's a bit more than $5/hour.

Holy speedy fingers, Batman! I'm lucky to tie 8/hr and that's the easy ones. Cheech you are a one-man sweat shop.

[ravenscry34]

How much would a Doz yellow humpies cost? I don't know how hard they are to tie, I've never even tried to tie a dry fly. Still trying to get the nymph flies down.

Thanks,
Jake.

[Trouty]

I'll vouch for Cheech (not that he needs it). He ties some of the most beautiful flies and he is fast too. Even if he is only making $5 bucks an hour - if he enjoys it, who cares. They are as good of a fly as you will get. If he wants to do it, don't dis him. On the other hand, I've heard riding with him in a truck with closed windows is considered a fate worse than death!!

PS Whatever happened to Mitch?

[UtahFlyGuy]

The way I get into a swap is if Cheech is in one. Nuff said.

[wildnative]

Nothing wrong with tying a few flies to make some extra $$ to pay for fishing stuff and maybe take the girls out for ice-cream. I used to tie for a few shops and individuals to pay for fishing stuff. I still tie for a few individuals when time permits and while a guy will not make a living doing it, he can make enough to buy materials, lines, waders, rods and ice-creams for the kids.

I watch a lot of tiers and Cheech is one of the best. Give him an order for a dozen or two. I guarantee you wont be disappointed.

[nightfish]

Dean, it looks like you're helping Cheech increase his profit margin. The nay-say is boosting his advertising exposure, and he's probably had a few orders placed just to prove you wrong. How kind of you to help a newbie get a good start! ;)

[cheech]

Thanks for the orders guys. I appreciate it. I really appreciate the props from you guys too.

To Dean,

You are questioning my cost accounting skills?? I guess I haven't figured out too many other ways to make money while I'm sitting on my butt in a hotel room 2 to 3 nights a week. I'm usually tying 1 to 2 dozen a night anyway, Why not sell them. I don't think you quite get how much money I'm trying to get here. It would be nice to be able to put a tank of gas into my car so I can go fish. It would be nice to be able to replace a fly line, etc. I'm not looking to start paying mortgage payments here. Lets see I'll break down the cost of tying a fly:

Hook: $.10 Good Japanese stuff.
Materials for hackled fly: $. 25 Whiting hackle.

Materials for non hackled fly: $.05

That's about $.15 to $.35 per fly. Were not really talking about time here because I'm doing it anyway. I guess there's no logic to selling flies for $1.50 each.

[cheech]

How much would a Doz yellow humpies cost? I don't know how hard they are to tie, I've never even tried to tie a dry fly. Still trying to get the nymph flies down.

Thanks,
Jake.

$18/ dozen.

Just shoot me an email to order them.

[Dean Wareham]

Cheek
Good luck. I did misunderstand how much money you were actually trying to make. One word of advice is to try and carve out a niche to separate yourself from all of the other tyers. I am sure you can tie an absolutely beautiful yellow stimulator or hares ear. But so can a lot of other tyers. You need to offer something with your name associated to it; ala Clouser, Harrop, etc.

[Tyson]

Cheek
Good luck. I did misunderstand how much money you were actually trying to make. One word of advice is to try and carve out a niche to separate yourself from all of the other tyers. I am sure you can tie an absolutely beautiful yellow stimulator or hares ear. But so can a lot of other tyers. You need to offer something with your name associated to it; ala Clouser, Harrop, etc.
Obviously you've never been to the fly tying section of this site or fished with the Cheechenstein series.
http://www.utahonthefly.com/flytying/flyarchive/cheechensteinpurple.htm

[Dean Wareham]

I hope Cheek isn't calling that one of his "originals". That fly is also known as a Mohican. It has been around for about 15 years or more.

[Foamy8]

That's how it is spelled.
You can call a fly whatever you want, he ties it and people buy it. You can change one thing and rename a fly. I hope you sell flies like hotcakes Cheech.

[Curtis Fry]

I hope Cheech isn't calling that one of his "originals". That fly is also known as a Mohican. It has been around for about 15 years or more.
Dean,
I think it would be nice if you could leave your criticism and negativity aside. Does it really matter if someone wants to tie flies for some money? Does it matter if someone calls a fly by a different name even though it's already been invented by someone (as obscure as it may be) 100 years ago? You seem like you want to make sure Cheech is in his place. Do you have something to prove?

No need to call them into question just because you've been fishing for 50 years and are an expert in all things -- we get that. We're all just here to have fun.

To quote the great one (Conan): Be cool my babies...

[Lonnie]

I hope Cheek isn't calling that one of his "originals". That fly is also known as a Mohican. It has been around for about 15 years or more.

Really? I was under the impression that this fly was a mohican?

http://www.flytyingforum.com/index.php?showtopic=16708&hl

http://flytyingforum.com/index.php?act=flyshow&showid=3465

But I thought the "cheechienstein" was a dumbell eyed zonker?

Could you explain the difference? I'm confused.

A rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

[Dean Wareham]

Looking closer it is Cheech. Like Cheech and CHong I get it now. Not being negative just being realistic. I tied flies for Dan Bailey back in the early 1980's I have seen flies come and go since the late 1970's. I have also seen fly tyers come and go during that time. Lake flies in particular have been ripped off and reinvented over and over through the decades. Do you know that Russ Blessing gets credit for the inventing the Woolly Bugger, but that fly had been in the West for years? It was called the Henry's Lake leech in the early 1970's. Another version was called the Black Martinez. Denny Rickards callibaetis nymph is a rip off of the shellback woolly or sheb woolly, another fly that had been around for decades before. I am not trying to be mean or negative I just think it is odd when somebody comes out and claims to be a professional fly tyer and then stakes a claim for inventing a fly that has been around for at least a decade and a half. My only point is that good fly tyers are a dime a dozen. Good flies are not dime a dozen. If Cheech can show me a good fly that he has come up with that nobody else had thought of that is a proven fish catcher he may be on to something. My e-mail is deanwareham@juno.com.

[Tyson]

If Cheech can show me a good fly that he has come up with that nobody else had thought of that is a proven fish catcher he may be on to something.
Look, pal, no one here needs to prove anything to you. And everyone knows sweat shop flies are pieces of crap.

[Lonnie]

If Cheech can show me a good fly that he has come up with that nobody else had thought of that is a proven fish catcher he may be on to something.

How about this one?

http://www.ratemyfly.com/image1.php?id=11&p=1

And for the record, I don't think Cheech is claiming to be a professional tier, but more like an entrepreneur. What I do know, from seeing lot's of his flies close up, is that the quality is there, the proportions are right, the wraps are tight, the materials are clean etc, etc, etc. All the things you look for are there. Now that is something you aren't going to get with flies you buy in a big box store or even some of the fly shops.

Are they worth $1.50 a pop? That's for the individual consumer to decide. It looks like you've decided in the negative, but lots of folks who've been here a long time and seen cheech's work will disagree with you.

Hey Cheech, put me down for a dozen assorted caddis...

L

[Curtis Fry]

If Cheech can show me a good fly that he has come up with that nobody else had thought of that is a proven fish catcher he may be on to something. My e-mail is deanwareham@juno.com.

Cheech, you need to show off the "Puñalazo de Burro" fly. Sweet bass fly that I can guarantee no one has ever tied before.

[Dean Wareham]

Plenty of flies look good on the internet, in books, magazines and in photos. But over the years most of those flies settle to the bottom of the heap and into obscurity. An example is Andy Burk. His flies look dandy but he has the reputation of tying "candy" flies that really aren't productive. Knowing what makes a fly effective is the talent. Knowing what triggers a fish to hit a particular shape, action, color, is the key. Why is a simple hares ear such an effective pattern? Why is a simple pheasant tail nymph such an effective pattern? Knowing what makes fish consistently take a particular pattern is the hard part. Anybody with 5 or more years of experience at the vise can crank out good looking flies. Look through old books and magazines of flies. You will see many flies that were "hot" flies or "flavors of the month". How many of those flies have really stood the test of time?. How many are still around today and being fished by anglers? That is my point. I am not trying to be critical or negative or put Cheech down. But when someone proclaims on the internet to the world that they are now a professional fly tyer, then later admit that they will be tying "professionally" while bouncing a 2 year old baby on their knee and blasting rock and roll music while "working" makes me wonder a little bit. Then they later confess that they will be tying mainly to kill hours sitting around in a hotel room on their bosses per diem.

[UtahFlyGuy]

This is not very constructive any more. Its just become a point of views issue anymore.

[fishynsmelly]

Plenty of flies look good on the internet, in books, magazines and in photos. But over the years most of those flies settle to the bottom of the heap and into obscurity. An example is Andy Burk. His flies look dandy but he has the reputation of tying "candy" flies that really aren't productive. Knowing what makes a fly effective is the talent. Knowing what triggers a fish to hit a particular shape, action, color, is the key. Why is a simple hares ear such an effective pattern? Why is a simple pheasant tail nymph such an effective pattern? Knowing what makes fish consistently take a particular pattern is the hard part. Anybody with 5 or more years of experience at the vise can crank out good looking flies. Look through old books and magazines of flies. You will see many flies that were "hot" flies or "flavors of the month". How many of those flies have really stood the test of time?. How many are still around today and being fished by anglers? That is my point. I am not trying to be critical or negative or put Cheech down. But when someone proclaims on the internet to the world that they are now a professional fly tyer, then later admit that they will be tying "professionally" while bouncing a 2 year old baby on their knee and blasting rock and roll music while "working" makes me wonder a little bit. Then they later confess that they will be tying mainly to kill hours sitting around in a hotel room on their bosses per diem.

Write a book or something. Either order some flies or hush already.

[fishynsmelly]

I am not trying to be critical or negative or put Cheech down.

But that is exactly what you are doing.

[Tyson]

Plenty of flies look good on the internet, in books, magazines and in photos. But over the years most of those flies settle to the bottom of the heap and into obscurity. An example is Andy Burk. His flies look dandy but he has the reputation of tying "candy" flies that really aren't productive. Knowing what makes a fly effective is the talent. Knowing what triggers a fish to hit a particular shape, action, color, is the key. Why is a simple hares ear such an effective pattern? Why is a simple pheasant tail nymph such an effective pattern? Knowing what makes fish consistently take a particular pattern is the hard part. Anybody with 5 or more years of experience at the vise can crank out good looking flies. Look through old books and magazines of flies. You will see many flies that were "hot" flies or "flavors of the month". How many of those flies have really stood the test of time?. How many are still around today and being fished by anglers? That is my point. I am not trying to be critical or negative or put Cheech down. But when someone proclaims on the internet to the world that they are now a professional fly tyer, then later admit that they will be tying "professionally" while bouncing a 2 year old baby on their knee and blasting rock and roll music while "working" makes me wonder a little bit. Then they later confess that they will be tying mainly to kill hours sitting around in a hotel room on their bosses per diem.
So you never became famous and now you're taking it out on Cheech.

[RipRap]

Dean, he can make money selling "basic" fly patterns. He doesn't need a signature line or series of flies to call his own in order to make money. That's just silly.

[nightfish]

Dean, I don't see where Cheech said he was selling new and unique patterns. Nothing about the latest & greatest. I'm sure he'll sell some Elk Hair Caddis, maybe some Goddards, a few wooly buggers and the like. There may be some "flavor of the month" orders too...maybe it's actually the current flavor. But whatever he sells will be quality tied.

Cheech doesn't need to create a niche. He has a niche...he's a local tyer that produces quality flies quickly. Who cares if he listens to loud music while he ties...are they quality flies only if the only sound in the room is the slow, wooden tick of a grandfather clock? Who cares if he ties with a kid in his lap...it's still the same person doing the wraps & quality control.

Hey Cheech, ya noobie, how long have you been selling flies now...3 years at least?

Dean, look around. There are more things new to fly tying than when you sold to Bailey's 25 years ago.

[Dean Wareham]

What demographic or market segment buys run of the mill every day flies? Mostly beginners. Nightfish you mention Elk Hair Caddis. One of the easiest flies there is to tie. A beginner that is not proficient at fly tying will buy elk hair caddis patterns no doubt. But will he buy them over the internet at $1.50 a pop or will he go to SW or Smith and Edwards and pay .89 cents for them? A beginner is not going to care or know the difference between an .89 elk hair caddis and a $1.50 elk hair caddis. They will both float, they will both have tan elk hair for wings.

That brings us to the intermediate fisherman and tyer. Most of them will have mastered the extremely difficult task of tying an elk hair caddis themselves. So why would they buy one from anywhere?

That is my point. The easy common patterns are typically bought by the beginner to intermediate level angler, that market segment is going to go the cheap route.

The more advanced angler isn't going to pay money for something he can tie himself. So where does that leave Cheech? Back to creating a niche or offering something unique that most tyers can't duplicate.

I have been in the profession off and on since around 1978, my family has been in the profession since the early 1950's. I have close friends still in the business. I think I know what I am talking about here.

Sure he will sell a few flies here and there, if that is what he wants to do fine. But I take it personally and I know others do to when people go around claiming to be a professional fly tyer when they probably haven't sold 500 flies in their entire life and have only been tying 5 or 6 years. I wish him well and hope he can make a buck or two. Going back to my first post on this subject it is very difficult to make any real money in this. Maybe in the 40's, 50's and through the 70's it was viable. But the importing and Umpqua Feather Merchants have really killed commerical tying in America. That is a heritage of hours since the Catskill days of Roy Steenrod, Helen Shaw, Harry Darby, etc.
I have beat this issue enough.
I will go back to trolling and lurking.

[CycleFish]

Dean,

Your putting far too much energy into this argument - who gives a #&^$. If cheep wants to tie put up or shut up!

[Red.Fly]

Apparently unless your name is Dean Wareham, you can't tie and sell flies.

I'm betting Dean hasn't ever seen one of Cheech's flies in person. Then again, I'm betting none of us has ever seen a Wareham Special for sale either. For a guy standing on such a tall pulpit and preaching condescendingly to the unholy breathren of UTOF, I've never heard of him. You would think he would know the difference between a Zonker and a Mohican being as versed as he is in fly pattern origins.

I've never met Cheech (or even been close enough to him to smell him), but I don't care if he ties naked as long as his flies catch fish and don't fall apart.

I say let the man tie.

[fulano]

I've never met Cheech (or even been close enough to him to smell him), but I don't care if he ties naked as long as his flies catch fish and don't fall apart.




Thanks for the visual. Damn, that's going to haunt me every time I tie on a Bunny Midge.

Seriously, why is everyone coming to the defense of Cheech? Have you seen the dude. He is a pretty big guy and though he has been nothing but nice to me, I sure wouldn't want to piss him off. Let him fight his own battles. Besides, this knuckle-head is making an argument about the pit-falls of trying to earn a living tying flies and that's not what Cheech is talking about.

[Curtis Fry]

I have beat this issue enough.
Amen, brutha. Dean, I'm sure you have a lot of experience and you've been around the block more than most people here, but you're obviously new to the internet discussion arena. Self-promoting comments like "I've been a tyer for xx years and tied for Dan Bailey yada yada" and the "holier than thou" attitude you're very clearly portraying along and critical and negative comments to others are just not really looked too highly upon. There are newbies here, oldies here and everything in between. We don't care if you've fished/tied for 2 months or 100 years. What does matter is that you're a person who obviously doesn't contribute much to the site and yet has the gumsion to rip on a guy who's a very good tyer and who's a regular contributor to the site.

As has been pointed out, you've spent WAAAAY too much energy on this thread already and as you can see 100% of the people responding think you're way off-base. That should hopefully help you see the point we're trying to make: It doesn't matter. If Cheech wants to tie a "hare's ear" and use two strands of crystal flash for the tail and call it the "Cheechenheimer Klingerdinger", then who the crap cares. And if he wants to sell them while he's sitting in a hotel room while he travels for his job -- who cares? Or if he wants to tie flies whilst sitting on the pot playing peekabo with a big brown, then again -- who cares. Why are you so fixated on this??

Anyway, sorry to rant, but this thread has been hijacked too far. You're welcome to stick around and make some positive feedback (I'm sure you have some experience and background to do that), so don't just take your toys and go home because of one thread that you got flamed on.

Peace...

Oh, just one final thought: What does everyone think about having a little Cheech vs. Dean fly tying competition. We'll do it a-la Iron Chef. 15 minutes time limit, mystery materials to tie with, and the most and best flies at the end wins. Independent panel of judges. We'll call it the "Iron Fly Tyer". How 'bout it?

[Tyson]

But I take it personally and I know others do to when people go around claiming to be a professional fly tyer when they probably haven't sold 500 flies in their entire life and have only been tying 5 or 6 years.
Dean, sorry your tying career didn't take off like you wanted it to. I think Cheech will be okay, he's not taking out a home equity loan to buy materials.

[cje04]

It would be nice to be able to put a tank of gas into my car so I can go fish.

I tie all my flies but I'll drive to see some of your wicked flies in action..

[WyFlyGuy]

Did I miss something here? I don't recall Cheech ever claiming to be a "professional tyer".

He's just trying to earn a few bucks and there are plenty of fisherman here that are more than willing to help him out (as evidenced by the several orders already placed). And some of those placing orders are perfectly capable of tying those patterns themselves.

[styan]

Could "Dean" be the old guy in the green hat???

[Fred]

Good luck, Cheech.

I might give you an order if I need anything. Can you do the Rickard's stillwater nymphs in olive and burnt orange?

Let me know, wicked awesome fly tyer.

[RogueFish]

I took delivery yesterday of about 300 flies from Cheech that he made. The quality rivals that of anything else I've purchased online or the local fly shops. I'm extremely pleased with these flies and am looking forward to this weekend to try them out. I've got nothing but great things to say about Cheech and his flies.

In regards to Cheech starting a side-business or second job for say tying flies in his spare time... I fully support it. If it is something he loves to do, I can't see how one could ever knock it for any reason whatsoever.

[Lonnie]

Oh, just one final thought: What does everyone think about having a little Cheech vs. Dean fly tying competition. We'll do it a-la Iron Chef. 15 minutes time limit, mystery materials to tie with, and the most and best flies at the end wins. Independent panel of judges. We'll call it the "Iron Fly Tyer". How 'bout it?

Dude. That actucally sounds pretty cool. We need a round robin tourney. 8 or 16 tyers head to head.....

Actually, I think Dean Wareham sounds a lot like Minivan...just under a new handle...

I think jester may be on to something.

[Utah DaveII]

seems like someone said that awhile ago.

[Lonnie]

seems like someone said that awhile ago.

Yeah, I remember now. Was it you? I honestly don't remember.

Jester, are you plagiarizing again? :)

L

[adams]

Maybe Cheech is Dean. Dean is Cheech. This was all just publicity stunt. :)

[Curtis Fry]

Actually, I think Dean Wareham sounds a lot like Minivan...just under a new handle...
Ding, ding, ding....we have a winner!

[Lonnie]

Ding, ding, ding....we have a winner!

IP address.

Inquiring minds want to know.

Come on, spill it.

[Junge]

Maybe Dean works for the DWR.

[styan]

Curtis is becoming a computer forensics expert with his new moderator role.

[Curtis Fry]

One IP address match can't clinch it, but these give some other clues in addition to the match:

http://www.utahonthefly.com/forums/showpost.php?p=144293&postcount=7
http://www.utahonthefly.com/forums/showpost.php?p=144327&postcount=9

Then again, this doesn't sound like Mini:
http://www.utahonthefly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14148

Who knows....

[Curtis Fry]

Curtis is becoming a computer forensics expert with his new moderator role.
Hell yeah!

[styan]

Hell yeah!
"Columbo Fry"

[Tyson]

Actually, I think Dean Wareham sounds a lot like Minivan...just under a new handle...
Dean Wareham/Minvan/Dave Jabrone
who else?
Latin Flyer? ;-)

[cheech]

What demographic or market segment buys run of the mill every day flies? Mostly beginners. Nightfish you mention Elk Hair Caddis. One of the easiest flies there is to tie. A beginner that is not proficient at fly tying will buy elk hair caddis patterns no doubt. But will he buy them over the internet at $1.50 a pop or will he go to SW or Smith and Edwards and pay .89 cents for them? A beginner is not going to care or know the difference between an .89 elk hair caddis and a $1.50 elk hair caddis. They will both float, they will both have tan elk hair for wings.

That brings us to the intermediate fisherman and tyer. Most of them will have mastered the extremely difficult task of tying an elk hair caddis themselves. So why would they buy one from anywhere?

That is my point. The easy common patterns are typically bought by the beginner to intermediate level angler, that market segment is going to go the cheap route.

The more advanced angler isn't going to pay money for something he can tie himself. So where does that leave Cheech? Back to creating a niche or offering something unique that most tyers can't duplicate.

I have been in the profession off and on since around 1978, my family has been in the profession since the early 1950's. I have close friends still in the business. I think I know what I am talking about here.

Sure he will sell a few flies here and there, if that is what he wants to do fine. But I take it personally and I know others do to when people go around claiming to be a professional fly tyer when they probably haven't sold 500 flies in their entire life and have only been tying 5 or 6 years. I wish him well and hope he can make a buck or two. Going back to my first post on this subject it is very difficult to make any real money in this. Maybe in the 40's, 50's and through the 70's it was viable. But the importing and Umpqua Feather Merchants have really killed commerical tying in America. That is a heritage of hours since the Catskill days of Roy Steenrod, Helen Shaw, Harry Darby, etc.
I have beat this issue enough.
I will go back to trolling and lurking.


Great post. You nailed it on the head. I only know how to tie an EHC, and I have tied for only 6 years. That part is true.

[wildnative]

What is the definition of a pro fly tier?

What is the definition of a quality fly?

If I sell one fly and make a buck, I'm a pro.

If my fly catches one fish and falls apart, it was a sucess.

This Wareham sounds a lot like I used to. Strange how jealousy works. I think I'm getting over it to a degree. After reading his posts, I want to get over it real quick!!!

[fishynsmelly]

I take it personally and I know others do to when people go around claiming to be a professional fly tyer when they probably haven't sold 500 flies in their entire life and have only been tying 5 or 6 years. I wish him well and hope he can make a buck or two.

I am a professional fly tyer.

flies sold... none

[Æ~FiX]

What does it matter if Cheech is a professional or beginner tyer? This thread proves that there is an obvious market for his flies.

[steelhead]

im a pro because i am..i invented fly tyeing.and the fly

[dan moulton]

Damn Cheech I'm not sure what an Internet mooning looks like but I think this guy needs one.

[styan]

Damn Cheech I'm not sure what an Internet mooning looks like but I think this guy needs one.
Something like this (|) .....

[skighhigh]

Cheek
Good luck. I did misunderstand how much money you were actually trying to make. One word of advice is to try and carve out a niche to separate yourself from all of the other tyers. I am sure you can tie an absolutely beautiful yellow stimulator or hares ear. But so can a lot of other tyers. You need to offer something with your name associated to it; ala Clouser, Harrop, etc.


Dean......some people never get it....Stay with your $1100 rod cause I heard that is what really makes a fly fisherman a fly fisherman.....I mean my old Snow 4-5wt will never catch as many fish as your bamboo...not in a millenia!
Do you love what you do? or do you love spending money at it? Just a thought from a rookie.............probably doesn't mean much to someone who can throw down over a grand for a rod, but hey if that is your niche so be it!!


ciao

[skighhigh]

I hope Cheek isn't calling that one of his "originals". That fly is also known as a Mohican. It has been around for about 15 years or more.


Dean,

Find a fly that has no characteristics of any other pattern. Most if not every pattern out there is in some shape,form or use of different material are a variation or improvement on anything else ever tied in the history of fly tying.

[chanceb]

I think Dean is just a product of his own arrogance, ego, and ignorance! If he knew Cheech's reputation like most of us on this site than he wouldn't have posted what he did. That said, if he did, than it truly does demonstrate what a dumb ass he really is!

[Utah DaveII]

this was from the need your help post,

is on a self imposed ban from the site. Although I am not convinced that you are not minivan, since I know from a recent e-mail that he can still see the site.

In the past mini has been more talk than real bite and the few times that I have meet him in person, he has been rather reasonable.

Wouldn't suprise me if that was him and it wouldn't suprise me if you are him reincarnated under a different name.


Jester, nobody reads my stuff anyomore so in a way you did come up with it first.

[styan]

I read your stuff...sniff, sniff... :>)

[Trav]

Ah shucks, it's too bad that Dean is probably Minivan...I was going to tell him that he is messing with a member of the UOTF round table and wasn't going to get anywhere...so give it up.

Cheek/Cheech does tie up some nice flies and is creative. The first time I seen the cheechinwhater I wanted to rip a few of those through the water.

What is funny is everyone is always willing to jump all over someone else...Sure in this case, it's probably mini, haha, good one, but I could see in the future that someone who not only talks the talk but walks the walk could get on here and people would push them away from UOTF just because they throw out their thoughts on something, which may go across the current and those who are "experts". In this case, it was the wrong avenue since Cheech is trying to do his thing and no one should bag on that...But what about a different topic...Seems like you go against the grain at times and that is taboo, unless your in the club. ;-)

[steelhead]

Ah shucks, it's too bad that Dean is probably Minivan...I was going to tell him that he is messing with a member of the UOTF round table and wasn't going to get anywhere...so give it up.

Cheek/Cheech does tie up some nice flies and is creative. The first time I seen the cheechinwhater I wanted to rip a few of those through the water.

What is funny is everyone is always willing to jump all over someone else...Sure in this case, it's probably mini, haha, good one, but I could see in the future that someone who not only talks the talk but walks the walk could get on here and people would push them away from UOTF just because they throw out their thoughts on something, which may go across the current and those who are "experts". In this case, it was the wrong avenue since Cheech is trying to do his thing and no one should bag on that...But what about a different topic...Seems like you go against the grain at times and that is taboo, unless your in the club. ;-) you know i was once in a club what a joke! good for cheech trying to sell his flys i sell afew myself.

[BassN]

...But what about a different topic...Seems like you go against the grain at times and that is taboo, unless your in the club. ;-)

Hey, I'm not in the club, but who cares. Trav, you seem a little sour grapes about not being in the club or a part of the "round table". I'm guessing your response would be "I don't care". But if so, then why even post it? Do you feel like an outsider because you're not in the UOTF club and go against the grain sometimes? Don't let it get you down, son, welcome to the "we're not in the UOTF insiders club and we're still good fly fishermen" club. Maybe if we can somehow find the secret high-sign, we'll be able to be cool too. j/k.

Don't let it bother you.

[Doug S.]

I'm pretty sure Trav is a "card carrying member" of the "club" :)

[«°Ñøvã°»]

E mail sent ,

[JayMorr]

This thread made me laugh!

Who gives a damn if someone wants to sell some flies? At least they are doing what they like and making a few bux on the side.

Sounds like another "Up One" on the other guy pissin match.

Cheech just do your thang. Tyin is fun and money is money....


Dean lets go fish!

[JayMorr]

PS. You noobs probably hurt Dean's feelins. ..... /yawn.

[skighhigh]

PS. You noobs probably hurt Dean's feelins. ..... /yawn.


Do you think??????????????????

[Stonefly100]

24 stimulators in an hour............................. You must have eight arms.

[cheech]

24 stimulators in an hour............................. You must have eight arms.

one of my favorites to tie

[skighhigh]

He does have eight arms between him and the youngsters, they are some tying kids!!

[«°Ñøvã°»]

Just got an e mail from Cheech...my flies are done....better hop on these deals before Cheech goes blind

[THeBLender]

cheech rox.

[chanceb]

Cheech is the man! Bad ass flies!

[Señorfish]

LLama Leech by Cheech is as sweet as a peach when I'm out and about and nothing else is working out

[Cary]

jesus, I head to the mountains for one week and I miss all this?

Cheech, got enough orders to tatke you through 2010? Ifr not, I'll put one together.

for the record, I've bought both rods and flies from cheech, and he knows his shizzzzzzzzz

[Curtis Fry]

Cary, did you take any pictures of the trip? I assume you did the Winds again...

[cheech]

Guys,

Thanks for the orders. I really appreciate it. I'm in the process of mailing / delivering flies. I have sent emails to those who I need payment from still.

I'm still going strong, and can take more orders (Cary...). I took a bunch of pics of flies that I have recently tied for people so you can see some samples. Shoot me an email if you want bugs! cheechfisher@gmail.com.

http://s37.photobucket.com/albums/e67/cpierce0311/flies/

[fulano]

Cheech,
You are one hell of a thread spinner man. Nice, tight looking flies.

[kingsonthefly]

Cheech it was a pleasure to meet you but im not sure if i said thank you before was kinda hectic at the job site but the flies look great now all i need to do is catch some fish to do them justice!

Chris

[cheech]

so how are my flies coming along? I could use them in the next couple of weeks fo shizzle...


I need to tie up 3 more Palominos for you. I cranked out all of the Hemingways tonight. I'll be out of town until Friday evening. If you want, I could meet you at Western to deliver them of Friday.

Those Hemingways are fun to tie.



Nova,

I have tried to call you again a couple of times. Those caddis have the kiss from my daughter and all. I'll be in SLC Friday evening if you want. Or we could just do it via mail.


Cheech

[«°Ñøvã°»]

I need to tie up 3 more Palominos for you. I cranked out all of the Hemingways tonight. I'll be out of town until Friday evening. If you want, I could meet you at Western to deliver them of Friday.

Those Hemingways are fun to tie.



Nova,

I have tried to call you again a couple of times. Those caddis have the kiss from my daughter and all. I'll be in SLC Friday evening if you want. Or we could just do it via mail.


Cheech
Oh man i hope i get to even use them this year if not there is always next year. With that special love attention im sure they will rock the river. My schedule is all messed up with school starting and this remodel i just started in provo. I appoligize for my absenteeism. Let's shoot for friday what time works for you? Worse comes to worse we can do the mail gig.

[Junge]

Cheech, did you get my email the other day?

[cheech]

Cheech, did you get my email the other day?


I don't think so. Do you need flies?

[Junge]

I'll resend.